For many years, with the current Moonie and the previous Sprinty, I've used Toyo T1-R in 215/40 17 size

A couple of years ago, I chanced across some Continental Sport Contact 3 at a good price, so I had them fitted to the fronts, with the 10% worn Toyos staying on the back

This was followed by many, many months of overly-sensitive handling - too much front grip and a loose-feeling rear end.

I played around with tyre pressures, camber and tracking settings, which reduced some of the oversteer tendency, but it never actually eradicated it. At any speed sub-60mph, it simply felt epic - the front end would just bite and as long as I was on the power, it just dragged the rear end round. However, at higher speed, it always felt a bit vague and didn't instil confidence. The worst case scenario was having to lift off the throttle at high speed - almost always requiring a light touch of corrective lock.

I wondered if the Quaife could be contributing - spoke to the techy guys at Quaife and they agreed that their diff would give more front end bite and would also shuffle grip around under braking or deceleration - they certainly recommended a different setup to a non-Quaife'd car

Today, I've had a pair of new T1-Rs fitted to the front and my neutral handling is back again! I can lift off mid corner and it hardly does anything at all - lifting off at high speed simply tightens the line a bit

What I have also noticed is that the T1-R isn't really as good as I remembered - the performance / cost equation is pretty well impossible to beat and I'll very quickly re-learn the slightly lower limits. Whilst out playing earlier today, I actually broke traction in a second gear left hander, whereas with the Contis, it just hooked up and fired off at the horizon

I think I'll run the Toyos for a year or so and then take a brave pill and lash out on a set of four AD08Rs....

Great Feedback Nigel!

So would you recommend the "continental sport contact 3" ?

great feedback Nigel

I'm just having my comp's mo6 refurb'd and new toyo 215/40 17's next month then front/rear white line arb's but in 2 minds about fitting my konis or fk coilovers

Fk coilovers over koni's. I never got on with them for some reason, even with the adjustment I couldn't get them to feel right like the coilovers did

While reading up on a lot of tyre reviews recently, I saw a lot of drivers of high performance cars saying that those Toyos are highly commended by people that haven't used some of the top end stuff. I've been wondering this myself for sometime regarding the Falkens. They are good intermidiate tyres but at your level Nigel, they're just not up to snuff. Let's be honest, performance cars that you would trounce wouldn't be fitted with Toyos by a manufacturer.



You'll need to fit those standard alloys you've previously hinted at going back to or upgrade to 8" wide wheels then because the weight rating is too low in 215/40/17.

I'm having 17x8 alloys fitted with AD08Rs all round and I'm very much looking forward to seeing how much better the car drives with some of the best tyres on the market. I can see myself falling out of the window on these standard leather seats though...

I'm not sure what to do - I could wait until the 17" Toyos wear out and then upgrade to something sticky, or I could just fit some 16" AD08Rs to the standard Plus wheels - there's one side of me that quite fancies doing a trackday with standard wheels on

All of my Ten of the Best outings were done on 16" wheels, so I know they are up to the job

My only other choice is to get new, wider 17" wheels and fit AD08Rs, keeping the current wheels for everyay use (but they are getting quite shabby now)

I'll be waiting for your report on the Yokos Ryan

Decisions, decisions.....

Don't have so much experience extreme driving Coupe on track(only few endurance races with stock tyres), but a lot with my friend's Alfa 145.
It had same weight balance as 20VT, almost same suspension, nitro was used as well......race slicks only different brands, used, bought off eBay.
Playing with pressure mostly, little bit of camber - or +......More toe in or out, we make rear end toe-adjustable as well......
After few trackdays the only thing i used for measuring rights or wrongs was laptimes. Driver's feel sometimes can be wrong, laptime is always right.
IMHO better laptime can be achieved when rear end is "controllably loose".....sometimes you can be faster with great grip in front and oversteered rear, sometimes otherwise. All this is driver dependant as well......
My point is that no matter what we prefer - more front, rear grip or neutral when driving on track, we must use laptime results for reference more that or "feel".....

Ryan what alloys are you going for? Pro race 1.2's

very interested in your idea of 17x8 especially if there is a handling benefit

If I was to ever buy brand new I was considering wider wheels but admittedly only due to the aesthetic side of things to fill that arch slightly, but must admit after reading so many threads on offset and the negatives of spacers etc was put off a bit
Interested to know what the difference would be
Aren't all 7 width alloys the same as standard regardless of tyres? Or are the plus alloys slightly wider?

Yes, but in a set of four

Used the Coupe for work this morning, instead of the Alfa GT diesel

Took my usual route and chucked the Coupe into a particularly nice roundabout, only to be greeted with loud and embarrassing tyre squeal - WTF?! - I don't even get tyre squeal from the Alfa on mid-range Falkens

I'm hoping they'll bed in a bit....

Again, during my reading I noticed a lot of people saying that R888s have a comparatively soft sidewall “and so they may be unsuitable for heavier cars”. Given that if we had the same weight on both front and rear axles, we’d be near enough 2 tonnes, I’d say that may qualify us…



Sounds like a decent enough plan to me.



It’s difficult with the limit of tyre choice we have in both 16x7 and 17x7 wheels. Very little of the top end tyres are available to us. You’ve got to have 18 or 19 inch wheels nowadays…

I make sure to write up a report!



Compomotive MO5s.



I wanted 5 spoke 17” wheels for looks and I wanted the AD08R tyres for grip and handling. The fact that the tyres and wheels are both heavier than standard means the ride will inevitably be worse, at least in the short term. I say short term because a full suspension refresh and coilovers set to manage the heavier wheels should offset that somewhat leaving me with grippy tyres. Technically, the handling will be worse too, owing mainly to more un-sprung weight but these tyres should transform it in terms of grip. At the moment, it just spins all through 2nd gear.

They should also look pretty mean in 235 width. They don’t require spacers or wobble bolts either which is another important thing for me and I’ve been assured that they do clear the Brembos too – which is nice!



All standard 16” wheels are 7” as I understand it. I’m sure it’s in the technical section somewhere…

FK's are rubbish, unless you like bouncing everywhere. I'd go with the Koni's

I fitted T1 rs to my daughters 1.2 fiat 500 ......Brilliant

So fitted a set to `the wives` `warmed` (180bhp) 500 Abarth ................................Rubbish...it scrubbed out the front end all over the place,dunno if side wall too soft or just doesnt suit the car.
It`s back on P Zero Nero`s dunno if the grip is massively better but far easier to handle now and no where near as much understeer.

I used to run T1 r`s on my coupe and thought they where ok ,so maybe something has changed with them ?

I know I keep saying it, Michelin PSS will transform the car.

It is a bit limited in terms of available sizes though.

I have Michelin Pilot super sport on my M3 and they are amazing! The grippiest tyre ive ever had in the dry and still great in the wet too!
Before these I had Pirelli for a bit and the older michelin pilot sport 2 on the car and could always get the rear to flick out a tad, now im going faster around the same corners and its just stuck to the road.
As above though, sizes are usually 18" upwards.

Regarding Nigels original post though, surprised you had mismatched tyres front and rear to be fair 450ish bhp you want the best premium tyres all round. Period.

The original idea after fitting the Contis was to put Contis on the rear as well, when the Toyos wore out.

Sadly, I destroyed the front Contis in very short order (track day at Bruntingthorpe) so the rears were still very good. Rather than throw away a good set of Toyos to fit four Contis, I chucked a pair of Toyos on the front. Not the best move in hindsight, but at least the car is balanced now, despite slightly less grip overall. I can play with camber and toe again to restore some of the lost front end grip, but for now, I'm really enjoying the high-speed stability that I've been missing for quite a while

Just fitted these to one of my other cars ( yesterday -after getting them recommended to me by many other owners at a meet)

Jimbo has used the correct word apart from putting MASSIVELY in front of 'transform'

Car used to have really severe snap oversteer ,i fitted a thicker rear anti roll bar which helped that a lot ,and sharpened up the steering,but after the recommendations , I have just taken off 1/2 worn P Zero's and fitted Michelin pilot super sports
Stunning difference in wet and dry grip ,and stability /turn in under hard braking ....and to finish it all off ,massively improved ride quality too --- even on 285/35/19's

Going on my coupe next too

I am using AD08R for a couple of months. IMO these tyres with the new R-compound are equivalent to Toyo R888 and Yoko A048 which I used 3 years ago. Last year I had 4 Federal RSRs and I think that YOKOHAMAS are definitely better!

So in terms of grip R888 = AD08R but when it comes to tyre life AD08R wins (treadwear 100 vs 180). And also they are cheaper than toyo!

I would quite happily try the Michelins, but nothing in 16" and only one 17"(205/45 - all wrong) means I'd have to buy 18" wheels to get the right tyre

This was a good read in deciding on the AD08Rs for me

Monsters of Grip - 2012 summer performance tyre test

Test Results page

I was a little disappointed with my T1R's after reading all the news on them on here. They have not lasted particularly well and the ride and grip did not improve as significantly as much as I had hoped for. I've come to the conclusion that money does pay when it comes to rubber so will be shortly looking at Yoko's (do they 16")/Conti's for my new pair for the summer. Anyone reccomend any Goodyears?

The pro race 1.2 in an 18" would look and perform amazingly on the coupe, great idea Nigel

Looks like that was based on the AD08 rather than the R version, I'm not sure what the difference is between the two though.

Well that's bloody embarrassing!

The difference is that AD08R has different compound (more sticky).

Yes, in both wet and dry situations so it'd be fair to say that it would probably fair even better in that test.

I would guess so. All I know is that the R is on the MSA tyre list 1b so I can't use them in the class I compete in for hillclimbing. If they had left the R off it would have been easier, but it looks like the AD08 will be out of list 1a next year anyway so I'll be looking for new tyres. Michelin PSS look great but that means the cost of new wheels as well as tyres, and if I get bigger wheels I may as well use bigger brakes and suddenly I will have spent a lot of money!!

Well they tested a 225/45/17, wouldn't that fit on a coupe with 17"s.

My Scirocco came with Bridgestones but these became very noisy, VW changed both rear wheel bearings before we figured it was tyres. I fitted the Michelins and instantly the car came alive, I'm on my second set now with the car at 75k kms. The RS5 will be getting a set as soon as the standard p-zeros wear.